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Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 3:46 pm
by chrisy
I thought I'd post here to see if anybody can shed some light.
I tried the ST pinball game "Obsession", and there is a significant delay between pressing a key and the flippers reacting. I'm hoping this wasn't present in the original game - the Amiga version running under the Minimig core has no such problem. I haven't tried much else on the ST core to know for sure if this is a core problem. Has anybody seen any input delays like this? Admittedly I'm using HDMI output, but measuring the delay on Slam Tilt on the Minimig core (a game I'm very familiar with) the difference between that and real hardware is virtually imperceptible. So I don't think it's HDMI output causing this although it may well be contributing.
I do not have a real ST to try the game on to see if it is genuinely slow to react, but my suspicion is that the ST core is causing the problem.
Are there any config settings which help?
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 5:07 am
by kathleen
@chrisy,
Have you tried with the Hatari emulator (on PC) to see how the game reacts ?
I still own a real Atari ST, so if you want I can give a try this week-end, just let me know.
Anyway, I'll try the game on my Mister just to be sure I understand the delay issue that you faced in.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:52 am
by FoxbatStargazer
Trouble is that Hatari itself should definitely add some delay, so it can be a bit tricky to compare against a software emulator on this point.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 3:33 pm
by kathleen
I've just tried on the Mister this game that I've never played before. Thanks for the discovery. I've already recreated the 2 disks for my STE (as it seems it is a STE game) so then tomorrow if I find a free window, I'll try on real hardware to compare the behavior and will let you know my feeling.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 9:37 am
by chrisy
Cool, thanks!
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:22 am
by Hodor
chrisy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 20, 2021 3:46 pm
I thought I'd post here to see if anybody can shed some light.
I tried the ST pinball game "Obsession", and there is a significant delay between pressing a key and the flippers reacting. I'm hoping this wasn't present in the original game - the Amiga version running under the Minimig core has no such problem. I haven't tried much else on the ST core to know for sure if this is a core problem. Has anybody seen any input delays like this? Admittedly I'm using HDMI output, but measuring the delay on Slam Tilt on the Minimig core (a game I'm very familiar with) the difference between that and real hardware is virtually imperceptible. So I don't think it's HDMI output causing this although it may well be contributing.
I do not have a real ST to try the game on to see if it is genuinely slow to react, but my suspicion is that the ST core is causing the problem.
Are there any config settings which help?
I´ve been playing this game on Mister recently and I haven´t noticed any significant lag. The flippers seem to react just as fast as Pinball Dreams on a real Commodore Amiga but I can´t compare to the original Atari STE hardware, unfortunately.
On the contrary, using Hatari emulator clearly brings some lag to the controls.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:37 am
by kathleen
@Hodor,
Same for me I did not notice any significant lag on the ST, comparing to PD on Amiga, the game play is different I feel PD much more realistic but this is not due to the Mister, this is due to the game itself.
I was not able to make the trial on my real ST for the unique reason that the disks that I wrote via my PC were not working, I did not pay attention that the disks are exceeding the 720Kb, I need to recreate them with another PC having a real floppy inside and not an USB. My bad.... Well to do so I'll need more time, but will do, despite I do not think that I'll see a different behavior, but I'm curious...(from nature
)
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:00 pm
by Hodor
kathleen wrote: ↑Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:37 am
@Hodor,
Same for me I did not notice any significant lag on the ST, comparing to PD on Amiga, the game play is different I feel PD much more realistic but this is not due to the Mister, this is due to the game itself.
I was not able to make the trial on my real ST for the unique reason that the disks that I wrote via my PC were not working, I did not pay attention that the disks are exceeding the 720Kb, I need to recreate them with another PC having a real floppy inside and not an USB. My bad.... Well to do so I'll need more time, but will do, despite
I do not think that I'll see a different behavior, but I'm curious...(from nature )
Me neither but I´m curious too
. Thanks for doing it.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:45 pm
by chrisy
Hmm, interesting. There is a noticeable delay here comparing Obsession running on the ST core with Obsession running on the Amiga core (and other Amiga pinball games) - the ball can roll almost from the top to the bottom of a flipper in the time it takes to respond.
I just tried tweaking some settings, using TOS2.06 instead of EmuTOS but it doesn't make any difference.
On this old thread:
https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16716 I see that there is some agreement that it lags even on real hardware.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 5:55 am
by churgle
The implementation hooks straight into the interrupt vector for the keyboard. So there is guaranteed no delay in the code.
Re: Obsession Keyboard Delay
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 8:37 am
by Kreese
I think the main "problem" when comparing Obsession (Atari STE) and Pinball Fantasies (Amiga) and the flipper mechanics is that in Obsession you can tap really fast and the flipper don't go all the way up. In Pinball Fantasies a tiny tap makes the flipper go all the way up. But I even tried some Pinball Illusion and in that game it's the same as Obsession, small taps makes the flipper only go up a small amount.
I can feel a little latency on Obsession. Sometimes the ball rolls over the flipper and down the drain, even that it feels that you should have made it.
By the way, when playing Obsession on the Amiga and press both shift keys at the same time, sometimes one flipper gets stuck up for me. Is it the same way for you?